Cramp Options

[Kerr]

Age old problem again.

At around 40miles on the test valley tour this sunday, cramp hit.
Funny as I kind of expected it to be about the 2800 - 3200 cals exertion.
And bang on there it was at around 3000 cals exertion.

Not too bad, but enough to put me walking for a mile until it released its grip.

I'm convinced this is fatigue in the support muscles mainly the inner thigh.
Unclipping and cycling on the heels seems to reduce the pain (stretching the inner thigh).

Im training to increase endurance and have seen a marked improvement as I gradually ramp up the miles.

What I want to know is what can induce the same adaptation in the gym or on short rides to increase the endurance of the support muscles. Im doing hiit , but this is mostly stationary bike (gym). I suspect i need to take this out into the woods and hammer HIIT on real hills and real singletrack.

Anyone know any HIIT exercises to target more of the muscles in the upper leg?

Kerr

[Gareth]

Basically I think you're right and it may be that you are using your inner thigh muscles much more when riding off road than you are on a stationary bike. Now the warm weather is with us (checks outside!) you should be able to get in some intervals on more difficult terrain. Pick a singletrack that makes for a fun fast descent with lots of steps, twists and turns and hammer up that, then rest, have a blast going back down and repeat. This will improve your muscle strength no end. You still need to get the miles in though, so don't totally neglect your distance work for this but build it in.

Finally although fitness has a lot to do with it you still need to work on your Magnesium/Electrolyte levels and get plenty of water or you could get cramp in almost any muscle once you are really tired.

So no easy solutions but lots of bananas, sunshine and sweet singletrack: bet your GP never came up with such a fun prescription!

[Geoffmbr1]

I agree with Gareth HYDRATION is the way forward , drink before your thirsty eat before your hungry that;ll sort it

[SuperJJ]

I suffer with cramp and find 'Zym' tablets really help for replacing lost electrolytes and thus reducing chances of cramp.

You can get them at CRC - ZYM tablets at CRChttp://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=20326

They taste a bit zingy but I find they do help.

[Kerr]

Cheers for the comments guys.

Im pretty convinced my cramping is fatigue not hydration or electrolytes.
I take the SIS electrolyte stuff during the ride and keep very well hydrated and fueled.
Might switch to zym when this lot runs out.
I carry a heart monitor so I can roughly eat the calories I burn.
Pee after rides is always a good colour and on long rides I even have a couple of stops to shake the hand of a good friend

Cramps come at the upper limit of my endurance i think. when the muscles are just starting to tire.
As Gareth says, I think I need to do more Hiit on real trails in the week and keep slowly upping the riding distance at weekends.

Its not so bad now that summer has finally arrived.

Kerr

[Rx1]

Cheers for the comments guys.

Im pretty convinced my cramping is fatigue not hydration or electrolytes.
I take the SIS electrolyte stuff during the ride and keep very well hydrated and fueled.
Might switch to zym when this lot runs out.
I carry a heart monitor so I can roughly eat the calories I burn.
Pee after rides is always a good colour and on long rides I even have a couple of stops to shake the hand of a good friend

Cramps come at the upper limit of my endurance i think. when the muscles are just starting to tire.
As Gareth says, I think I need to do more Hiit on real trails in the week and keep slowly upping the riding distance at weekends.

Its not so bad now that summer has finally arrived.

Kerr

Good luck with this Kerr.

I tend to get cramps in my quads when they are completely fatigued and, like you, I'm pretty sure it's not an electrolyte/hydration issue given how disciplined I am about fluid intake. The sensation I have is more like a spasm than a cramp with the quad locking up, to the point if it's got really bad, that I can't stand up! I've found that by reducing the power demand (i.e. not trying to power up hills in the big ring too often) and upping the cadence, I can go longer before this happens, if at all.

Might be worth trying too. But I agree with Gareth, the best training is off road and in my experience the endurance will follow.

[Kerr]

Good luck with this Kerr.

I tend to get cramps in my quads when they are completely fatigued and, like you, I'm pretty sure it's not an electrolyte/hydration issue given how disciplined I am about fluid intake. The sensation I have is more like a spasm than a cramp with the quad locking up, to the point if it's got really bad, that I can't stand up! I've found that by reducing the power demand (i.e. not trying to power up hills in the big ring too often) and upping the cadence, I can go longer before this happens, if at all.

Might be worth trying too. But I agree with Gareth, the best training is off road and in my experience the endurance will follow.

Did 55 miler round the chilterns on saturday. I had my HRM and monitored the calories. Did my best to eat and drink them back as I went. Drank gallons of SIS electrolyte (it was hot). Kept my cadence high and backed off from the power about 20% on the the hills. I also stopped on the hour for 5 mins rest and enjoy the view.

NO CRAMP!!!

But another issue has arrive. Think im at the limits of the comfort of a charge spoon. Might need to get some sudocream.

Knocking it up a bit more next weekend. Planning around 57-58 miler.

Kerr

[Rx1]

Did 55 miler round the chilterns on saturday. I had my HRM and monitored the calories. Did my best to eat and drink them back as I went. Drank gallons of SIS electrolyte (it was hot). Kept my cadence high and backed off from the power about 20% on the the hills. I also stopped on the hour for 5 mins rest and enjoy the view.

NO CRAMP!!!

But another issue has arrive. Think im at the limits of the comfort of a charge spoon. Might need to get some sudocream.

Knocking it up a bit more next weekend. Planning around 57-58 miler.

Kerr

Good news/bad news...

[bobosola]

But another issue has arrive. Think im at the limits of the comfort of a charge spoon. Might need to get some sudocream.

Somone here put me on to Gore short liners a couple of years back. I though all short liners were they same before trying them. It's the long rides where you very literally feel the difference in quality and support. Gore don't seem to sell separate liners any more, but if I had a money to spare I would fancy a pair of Alp-X shorts for a really long ride.

[Kerr]

Somone here put me on to Gore short liners a couple of years back. I though all short liners were they same before trying them. It's the long rides where you very literally feel the difference in quality and support. Gore don't seem to sell separate liners any more, but if I had a money to spare I would fancy a pair of Alp-X shorts for a really long ride.

UPDATE:

I seemed to have sorted the posterior problem with just getting some smaller cycling shorts. I kinda neglected to realize that size 42 shorts dont fit a size 30 waist. The pad was loose and was moving around hence the irritation.

Next problem is I get a pain on the outside of the right knee at around 55 miles. Some reading says this is the saddle height/position to high.
I broke my leg in my 30's and had it all screwed back together such that the broken leg is now about 3mm longer than the right leg. This seems logical as the right leg gets the pain but saddle hight is perfect for the left leg. So i need to put some shims under the right cleat.

Ive had no cramp problems since I started to use an HRM to keep my heart rate down. I aim for 135-140 max and this seems to keep me from fatigue.

One thing I really struggling with is eating enough. Ive unintentionally dropped 2lbs in the last two weeks even though I eat back my ride calories + 2500 cals maintenance. Im starting to think my HRM calories burned is out by quite a bit.

[Kerr]

Another UPDATE:

60 +miles on the south downs and still no cramp, even in grueling rainy, muddy, humid conditions.

The yesterday I did over 7 hours and felt nearly as fresh as the start!
Ive now added some kendal mint cake to my armoury of energy. Its great stuff, Almost pure sugar, but the mint taste helps it stay nice and comfortable in my stomach.

Here comes the science bit...

I burned 4100 cals yesterday.
I ate back 1600 during the ride and started with a 700 cal breakfast 1 and a 1/2 hours before starting riding.
At he beginning of the ride I was getting 200 cals an hour (via drink and bars). The second half this was about 300 cals per hour and I felt MUCH better.
So It seems I need at least 300 an hour and my body is happy to get 280 ish an hour from stores.
I have a warning when my Heart rate goes over 143 on my HRM and I think this is crucial for preventing fatigue. If it alarms I stop or slow or even walk. This keeps me from burning muscle and keeps latic acid from building which prevents fatigue and ultimately eradicates Cramp!

[Rx1]

...
I have a warning when my Heart rate goes over 143 on my HRM and I think this is crucial for preventing fatigue. ...

That's where I went wrong on Mountain Mayhem: my HR went up to 184!

[Mikhaela]

I was advised to eat bananas too. But I never thought giving your body its needs before it even asks for it would help.

[glynn six 0]

I was advised to eat bananas too. But I never thought giving your body its needs before it even asks for it would help.

spam alert!