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> Latex question
Robs
post Jun 9 2009, 04:18 PM
Post #1


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Joined: 30-April 09
From: Concrete Jungle



Hi all, has anyone used Stans or similar to just "paint" the inside of a sidewall to seal up some small holes?
I'm using the glycol gloop in the rear tyre but I have about 3 holes which seal up nicely in the workshop but which blow open again on the trail and seep air after a sharp edge hit or big drop.
I get about half an hour of riding once that happens before I need to pump up again which is long enough that I can't be arsed to fix them with a stab-in type repair kit but short enough to be annoying. Also when I overload the pressure at home I can see about 20+ reeeeally tiny dots of seepage so I reckon the whole sidewall could do with looking at. (ALL on one side of the tyre - looks like a manuf. flaw actually)
The tyre is oldish and I've got a replacement but there's lots of tread left.
UST rims + tubeless ready tyres FYI.
Anybody tried it?

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Jarl
post Jun 9 2009, 06:01 PM
Post #2


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From: Bath/Hampshire (uni/home)



If your tubeless ready tyre is leaking air, go moan at whoever you bought it from if you can. Tubeless ready should be air-tight.


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Gareth
post Jun 9 2009, 06:09 PM
Post #3


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Joined: 28-July 04



I would say that Stan's is not suitable for this. Sidewall holes are the worst as the tyre carcass is generally much thinner there and even plug type repairs are not recommended, there is just not enough thickness.

Instead you should patch the inside of the tyre with vulcanising rubber patches in the same way that you would make a permanent repair of an inner tube. Take care if sanding the inner tyre wall as the butyl layer is so thin that you can easily sand it off down to the threaded carcass, not a good idea. Better to just clean off the surface with alcohol.

All this pre-supposes that the holes are quite small otherwise the patches will bulge out of the holes. 2mm is about the max.

If this all sounds like too much work I would bung a tube in until the tread is worm down and you replace the tyre.

If any hole in a sidewall is over 2mm then you will need a tyre boot and a tube to get it going but I would replace any tyre with a cut sidewall sooner rather than later. If this happens more than once you need to run tougher tyres, there are lots out there.

Plugs are fantastic in the tread of the tyre up to about 5mm.

Stan's will seal small holes in the tread up to about 2mm and very small leaks in sidewalls e.g. the porous sidewalls found on non-tubeless ready tyres. Be aware that you will need to top up porous tyres more than tubeless ready until they fully seal.


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Robs
post Jun 9 2009, 09:14 PM
Post #4


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Joined: 30-April 09
From: Concrete Jungle



Ta guys,
The tyres are Bonty big earls and have been more than tough enough up until now.
I already have a couple of plugs in the main tread working perfectly and the seeping holes are small - sub 0.5mm - I guess my disappointment is with the gloop, as I'm pretty sure a latex solution would be working on holes like that.
Like I said the tyre is oldish, about 2yr since purchase but was off the bike for about a year, besides which I remember reading Keith Bontrager himself saying it's not out of the ordinary for tubeless tyres to leak as much as 5psi in a day (which sounds like a get-out clause if you ask me!)
Annoyingly the front tyre (identical) has no issues and I've been running it completely dry (I know, dangerous and not recommended) for the same length of time.
Gareth I can't go back to tubes! That would be an admission of failure! laugh.gif
Until now I haven't had to trail fix a leak for 2years and I was a snakebite specialist!

Internal patches are fine but I've got so many mini holes I'd like to attack the lot at once.
Hmmm, I may have a try with latex but I'm wondering if you need pressure behind a latex solution to really drive it into the pinholes.
Maybe I'll try and refit the tyre and inflate before the stuff can dry fully.
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Jarl
post Jun 9 2009, 10:39 PM
Post #5


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From: Bath/Hampshire (uni/home)



QUOTE(Robs @ Jun 9 2009, 10:14 PM) *
I remember reading Keith Bontrager himself saying it's not out of the ordinary for tubeless tyres to leak as much as 5psi in a day (which sounds like a get-out clause if you ask me!)


I wouldn't touch a tyre system that leaked 5psi a day with a 30 foot barge pole blink.gif


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Robs
post Jun 10 2009, 11:05 AM
Post #6


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Joined: 30-April 09
From: Concrete Jungle



Everything leaks, it's a question of degree,
Typically I run about 28psi at the rear for regular trail duties and would probably lose 4-5psi between rides (say 3days)
If I ran 60psi all else being equal I suppose that could possibly fizz away 5psi in 24 hrs.
The systems advantages are, for me, so major that a quick top up before a ride is no biggie, but losing significant amounts DURING a ride is deffo not on.
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Doug
post Jun 10 2009, 11:52 AM
Post #7


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Joined: 25-May 05
From: Wrexham, N.E.Wales.



Get one of these and plug them up properly. It won't be a waste of money as they are great for fixing tyres on the trail. I cut a tyre on the Dyfi Enduro this year. The sealant would hold up to about 25psi but no more. It still had 15-20 psi in it after I'd fixed it properly meaning a load less faff pumping it back up. wink.gif

Cut the slugs in half for more smiles per mile. You can cut them into 3 but that it gets harder to fix larger holes without pushing the slug right the way through by accident.


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Jarl
post Jun 10 2009, 12:46 PM
Post #8


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Joined: 12-November 06
From: Bath/Hampshire (uni/home)



QUOTE(Doug @ Jun 10 2009, 12:52 PM) *
Get one of these and plug them up properly.


That's a really good price. Spare slugs can be had on ebay for not-a-lot, too smile.gif


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Robs
post Jun 10 2009, 11:23 PM
Post #9


Group: Members
Joined: 30-April 09
From: Concrete Jungle



QUOTE(Doug @ Jun 10 2009, 12:52 PM) *
Get one of these and plug them up properly. It won't be a waste of money as they are great for fixing tyres on the trail. I cut a tyre on the Dyfi Enduro this year. The sealant would hold up to about 25psi but no more. It still had 15-20 psi in it after I'd fixed it properly meaning a load less faff pumping it back up. wink.gif

Cut the slugs in half for more smiles per mile. You can cut them into 3 but that it gets harder to fix larger holes without pushing the slug right the way through by accident.

Ta Doug, already do, they're definitely great!
But I was also toying with the idea of trying to get a load of the teensy tiny holes that you wouldn't bother with normally, done in one go.

Incidentally, I took that very kit - including the 2 sharp metal stabbing spikes and razor sharp knife - through airport security in my hydration pack once by mistake rolleyes.gif and they completely missed em. Tsssk. doh.gif


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Gareth
post Jun 11 2009, 10:15 AM
Post #10


Group: Root Admin
Joined: 28-July 04



Stan's will seal 'small' sideholes (usually a hole will have to be at least a couple of mm before it won't seal with Stan's and then it's big enough for a plug without being reamed larger). I wouldn't paint it on though but would put 60-100mills in the tyre as your puncture proof solution. think.gif


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Robs
post Jun 12 2009, 05:40 PM
Post #11


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Joined: 30-April 09
From: Concrete Jungle



Went the old fashioned route in the end and patched from the inside but my god what a faff!
APART from clearing out the old goo, the inner surface of TLR tyres is slippery like polythene, unlike my Maxxis USTs which are nice n rubbery.
Even after using detergent and rinsing to really clean the area and then a really light abrading (it really doesn't take much to go through to the fibres in a TLR tire!) 1 of the 3 patches didn't 'take' despite leaving overnight with a tube inside at 70 psi. The rubber solution just peels right off.
So I gave them a wipe with acetone then redid them (+ 2more I'd found with a high pressure test and no sealant).
They APPEAR to be much better, time will tell.
Since then I've found that Weldtites new tubeless patch kit ( the inside version, not their stab-in type) uses superglue as an adhesive!! I would've thought that would be too brittle.
I've heard of it being used for pinhole repairs but surely a large area would crack???

Still think I should've experimented with painting some latex on icon_redface.gif

Anyhows, 2hours offroad today, several 4ft drops to flat, couple flights of steps (inc up 6 at speed), lots of hard sharp edges, started out with 30.5psi, came home with 31.5 !! Result!! tongue.gif
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